water/liqued cooling

[teamv]

Taffspeed are on with a bolt on kit for the rb range ,there hoping to have one set up and running by the end of june :bouncyeng: ,ive put my name on one.

[lifes a drag]

theres a bit about water cooling on the LCGB site on the tuning and kit section under using the frame to cool scooters , heres what a guy who had one years ago has to say ,

The captains right,i had the blue series one,(formally 'out of the blue,into the distance) a very young Mark Broadhurst did the barrel jacket for all three barrels under his mums house in the workshop/cellar.I built my series one and martins GP and dave built his own in liverpool after i had assembled the engines and mastered the plumbing and piping for them.
Martin Buckley had the red gp ,but no water in the frame,just radiator/pump to barrel,mine and Dave Dawes had water in the frame,and radiators on the front,running original red boxed electronics,but re wound by mark stevens to give 12 volts to power the caravan shower pumps for the water circulation,auto controlled by car radiator fan switch built into the barrel cooling jacket.H2 750 lc pistons ,offset pin cranks giving 60.5 ml stroke,proper 240 old school engines.The most consistently powerful engine i have ever owned,could be held at full bore on the motorway until you got fed up/frightened/paranoid/out of fuel.
Martins GP ended up in fast( fat) eddies hands,in oldham,and become 'RESPECT''daves scooter went to stan in liverpool, and mine went to 'TEFF' from chorley,a mate of Midges and i havent seen it since.
25 Years have passed since all three were on the road,and in comparison to what we were doing with our scooters and engines then,not much has changed.Once you have removed the problem of overheating in lambretta engines,as we had,there was very little else to go wrong,all the other problems seemed to dissapear,we carried no tools,just 10p for the phone,we went everywhere for two years solid on them,all three of us,and besides general maintainence,they ran like clockwork,fast,reliable and trouble free,they were so good that we could not fault any of the three scooters that we had evolved, and finally declaired it was mission accomplished.
fastcol

[lifes a drag]

heres a bit more info on them , i think mark broadhurst is the mat to see " i hope you have lots of cash though "

There were three, they were water cooled Kawasaki 240 conversions using cast iron cylinders most of the fins removed, with a jacket welded to them.... These were supplied by Mark Broadhurst back in the early to mid 80's...... These conversion consisted of a radiator, a welded up frame which held the water for the cooling system with plumbing added, a 12 volt water pump, a sender unit for the pump, and a temperature sender..... A lad in Anfield, Liverpool, had one in a 1958, LI125 frame breather....Then there was a Lad called Martin from shaw near Manchester he had one in a GP 200 Electronic....and another lad called Big Colin who lived out towads Manchester he also had one, I think it was in a Series 2 LI.... The first outing for all three scooters was to the Isle of White around 84-85, I think Kev walsh travelled down with them.... Martins GP was always the fastest..... another lad from Liverpool (Stan from Garston) very well known scooterist who was on the scene since 79...... He ended up with two of them The GP being the first.....Which was written off when a car pulled out on him.... Then he bought the second this was the Frame breather which he had till he sold it to a lad in Newcastle, about 92-93....but it was now running without the water in the frame and just had a header tank and radiator....

[jason frost]

Ive being thinking about some sort of ducting system starting from the bottom of the legshields running down and force feeding cold air straight onto the head through the cowling...

Heres one Im working on, still need to work out the best way of getting the hot air out from under the panels, maybe using the rear grill and the area under the number plate

[rossi46]

Mate has his TS water cooled with a rad under the flooboards, said he usually runs at about 65 but was on the rally in london last year, not able to get going due to traffic and it went up to 110. said he was shi**ing himself. Says they are great when moving but not so clever when in traffic.

Thought i would add that useless bit of advice....

sef

so true ! if you look at most water cooled modern they have a small electric cooling fan fitted to them, the best way would be to go the Harley way !! a water cooled cylinder but with fins on the outside.

[sydduckett]

Rossi, yeah i agree. he has the kit for about5 years and said that it is bullet proof when your moving but when your poodling or idle (eg town) for any period of time the temp starts to rise. I guess the only way round this is to fit a fan, then unless you spring a leak your pretty much sorted. Persoanlly id go for a rad/fan combo in a legsheild tookbox with a subtle number oh holes let into the front of the leggies for air flow.

Now all we need is for someone to make us the whole shooting match for a century and we are laughing.....

sef

[rossi46]

you wouldn't have to put hole in the legshields , put the holes under the front mudguard and make and fit some kind of scoop inside the mudguard to channel the air into the toolbox. You could even put a separation panel in there and use a radiator of something like a moto cross bike or trials bike, one that is narrow and small. You can buy various sizes of fans and wire it to run off the stator, on a switch. Turn it on in traffic and off when moving.

[Andy Pickering]

Ive being thinking about some sort of ducting system starting from the bottom of the legshields running down and force feeding cold air straight onto the head through the cowling...

Heres one Im working on, still need to work out the best way of getting the hot air out from under the panels, maybe using the rear grill and the area under the number plate

Same wavelength Jason...Something I have in mind regarding expeling the heat would be a vented flywheel cover, vented around the outside of the flywheel cover which I was summasing would turn the rotating flywheel from forcing cool air into the head area to forcing the hot temps out of the vents in the flywheel....It would certainly give it an escape ...Another idea I have is to incorporate a fan in the ducting to force more air through (non electric) which would run solely on force from the air being forced in..much the same as a childs windmill being blown..

Andy.

[goldeneye]

Then he bought the second this was the Frame breather which he had till he sold it to a lad in Newcastle, about 92-93....but it was now running without the water in the frame and just had a header tank and radiator....[/quote] if it"s the same scooter, which i think it is, the lad from newcastle is my mara phil stewart, and it ended up wearing a watercooled TS1, broady outboard hydraulic disc , and all manner of fancy goodies (very unusual to see such a trick Series 1 at that time) it was painted standard red and white.. so to the untrained eye it looked like an old scooter.... until..... NEWWWOOOOW! he ran it in , and used it locally to iron out any problems, then went to the scarborough rally that year (95?) where it was nicked by some scumbag from outside the digs, and never seen again. he wrote a poem in scootering about it getting nicked , and the last picture i saw of it, he"d made it into a xmas card for us! he can be seen at most rallies now on his purple and cream "ARTHUR DALEY EXTRA E-TYPE" TS1.

[sydduckett]

Right i dont care so im going to ask. No f***ing stick though right...Whats a frame breather?

Cant handle not knowing...going to shed now to try the main beam to see if it will take my weight..

Sef