agusto experts please advise

[camel]

I took the Agusto unit off my GP with the ADS3 pipe... 6k revs was what I found to be the maximum in practice on the road with that pipe, and pootling around with the pack I was nowhere near that in practice.

I have found better results with that pipe without....

ok thanks....basically your saying with the agusto it wouldnt rev past 6k but without it was?

No what I'm saying is that the ADS3 pipe in practice does not really want to go much above 6k, so therefore most of the time you are not at the end stop of the unit.

I set a fixed 18deg and my scooter is happy with it, with that pipe.

ok get you....
basically im trying to determine weather its the pipe or the agusto stopping me get past 6k revs..
the dyno printout shows it holding power to 7k but on the road its maxing out around 6k as you said
cheers

[nelson pk]

You could be playing into the demon's hands!

Too much ignition advance will make you pink, however, 'backing off' will result in the revs dropping off and the timing advancing again, which in turn can lead it to run hotter One of the commonly reports from people with EGTs and advance/retard ignitions is that they can't ride slowly with packs of standard machines or their revs drop off, ignition advances and temps creep up. In this case you either need to keep the revs up to retard the timing and bring temps down or rotate the stator so that the whole of the range is retarded a little.... or just cane it everywhere!

Adam

I heard you say this before about EGT temps going "up" with advancing the timing but this does not ring correct for me.
When i advance the timing on my scoot the EGT temp goes down and there is a logical reason for this..........
When you advance the timing you are putting more heat in the head and less out of the pipe because its firing earlier.
EGT's go up when you "retard the ignition" because the charge is burning hotter when it goes into the pipe because it has fired later in the cycle.
Try retarding your ignition with the same jetting and watch your EGT's go up significantly!
If you advance the timing your EGT should go down and CHT should go up. If you retard the timing your CHT should go down and EGT should go up.
I have mentioned this before but nobody seems to pick up on it.
EGT's generally dont go up with advanced timing they go down. Remember you are measuring exhaust gas and not head temperatures.
For exact EGT readings use an accurate probe (about £100's worth) and a digital readout otherwise its not very accurate. I've seen the cheap analogue ones that people go for because they are....well....cheap....... and i have to ask how you can read them accurately on a vibrating lambretta when the difference between 600 degrees and 650 degrees is so small on the gauge?

I'm guessing Adam was just generalising and trying to illustrate the scenario where the heat generated at low revs at say 21-23 deg BTDC can be potentially damaging to the engine, which it can be....compared to 17 deg etc. But that aside, I can also confirm Nelson PK is correct, when I was experimenting on the dyno with various ign curves/retard settings on an MTech a while back, I put the timing just past peak RPM very close to TDC to experiment with gearing and over-rev......and had the downpipe on an exhaust on a tuned RB glowing orange on one setting........lol......I decided not to run that setting in the end!! lol

Bloody hell!!

I totally understand where Adam was coming from and what he was trying to say so i hope it didn't come across as though i was having a pop or something because i wasn't. Just trying to illustrate how an EGT generally works and reads.

[Adam_Winstone]

Hi guys, don't worry, I too understand where you are both coming from... and I too have had a downpipe beyond cherry red (getting towards orange) when trying to cool a motor that I'd built with too much compression

Yep, my comment was more about general engine running temps, rather than immediate EGT temps.

Adam

[camel]

just to close this thread for me...you lot can carry on if you want to lol,today i rechecked my timing and used a strobe against the rev counter this time,it was spot on...at 6k revs its retarding to 16 degrees,i think what threw me was my dyno print out
it shows power being held to gone 7k
but on the road realistically power is dropping off at 6.3k
Foreman bob and Darrell Taylor who have both used these pipes confirmed that
just goes to show that using a dyno isnt gospel
just means my overall speed isnt quite what i expected
at 6.3k at 4.7 final drive im probably getting near 70mph
but plenty of torque up to that point
i could up the front sprocket by a tooth but i did have problems slipping the clutch with this set up in the past
so im leaving it alone for a while
thanks again

[Darrell Taylor]

? can you confirm something regards before and afters
way i read it was
1 you had it dynoed with ads3 and standard ignition(what timing?)
2 you then fitted an augusto currently timed at 16degrees at 6k

ads is approx 6k peak on std set ups depends what you fit it to and how wide the spread is could mean it makes the same power at 5 , 6 and 7 k
this is one i tuned peaks at 7k
http://scooterotica.org/forum/viewtopic ... 45&t=21855

if you had it dynoed with std ignition at say 18 degrees and your graph shows it peaking at 7 k then try to repeat that ,then fuel it to remove the pinking below

also does the speed drop off at 6300 now the augusto is fitted ,but the dyno graph before showed power till 7 ? r we comparing apples with apples?

[camel]

ok facts
it was dynoed exactly how the motor is spec,d now....ie with the agusto 6000 set to retard at 6k to 16 degrees
the printout shows max power between 6 and 7k@22.78bhp
and torque between 5 and 7k maximum @18.88ft/lbs
but on the road it rides lovly confirming the graph until 6.3k maybe 6.4 then the power dramatically fades,i can hear nails in the cylinder and i can sense a seizure so i back off

[Darrell Taylor]

does it do that in all gears or just top


id try a much bigger main jet /check fuel delivery etc and air leaks via a leakdown test, probably not ign related

[camel]

well its top where i notice it as i dont hold it at peak revs while accellerating
and yes my graph is very similar to yours with the sil barrel
i,l check the flow rate of the tap i think then,noticed quite a few air bubbles in the fuel line
cheers

[Darrell Taylor]

not bad going then for a £100 sil kit

[camel]

no this is a £400 quid 225 sluggello that i got free thats had the reed treatment,but yeah ive done a sil barrel too,its nice too see good results such as the one youve done without breaking the bank on kits