One for Barry@Bikesure

Who do YOU insure your scooter with, give recommendations and opinions...
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coaster
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mick1 wrote:
Changing traditional light bulbs for LED ?

Changing from split rims to tubeless ?

I know it can be a grey area but ( for insurance purposes) where does "modification" start ?
Most roders would not think it necessary to declare mods like these as they are concidered as safety improvements as are hydraulic disc brakes. Do any insurers explain what constitutes a modification that might void the insurance? Or even offer a discount for the safety ones?
dave-g
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Cheers Barry, I'll get a quote from you when it's due
gavi4t
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heres a daft one ,did everybody know if you run a classic policy that you don't accrue no claims bonus? nope none at all ,so when you decide that you would like to insure something like a px125 disc that isn't classic your 5 years of riding a 69gp 200 wont count as ncb and you have to start again ,a bit of a loophole that I wasn't aware of til the other month when I went to insure a fireblade :shock:
mick1
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Barry has some fair points and i'm not trying to make the insurers out as "bad people" i was just wondering what constitutes a modification and what would be reasonable for the scooter owner to know. basically i bought a vespa 125 and consequently found out it was kitted. I'd insured the scooter in good faith and didn't realize i had to do an engine strip to confirm the cc or check for any modifications (other than were visual).

I totally agree it's wrong to knowingly insure a 225 as a 125 but it's more the minor modifications that confuse me. As has been said there must be very few few scooters (certainly Lambrettas) that have the same spec' as they left the factory.

Regarding upgrading the brakes, i've "heard" this may increase your insurance as you may feel you can travel at faster speeds :o

It's all a mine field and a blanket cover of saying all modifications must be notified can cause a Lambretta owner endless problems......if they notified every change.

All good points though
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coaster
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There was a case on Watch Dog a few years ago where a young girl had just passed her test and bought a Fiesta 1100. It subsequently got stolen and trashed. The insurance company refused to pay out because it had been fitted with XR2 Pepperpot ally's and she hadn't declared it :roll: The insurance company claimed that the wheels made it more attractive to would be thieves :?

With all due respect to Barry, Insurers ought to have a checklist of typical items that would be considered to be modifications to run through with each application rather than setting a trap for the unwary.
carlosfandangles
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coaster wrote:There was a case on Watch Dog a few years ago where a young girl had just passed her test and bought a Fiesta 1100. It subsequently got stolen and trashed. The insurance company refused to pay out because it had been fitted with XR2 Pepperpot ally's and she hadn't declared it :roll: The insurance company claimed that the wheels made it more attractive to would be thieves :?

With all due respect to Barry, Insurers ought to have a checklist of typical items that would be considered to be modifications to run through with each application rather than setting a trap for the unwary.
But that argument was very straight forward - if the two Fiestas were side by side in a car park, which would be most theft attractive - the one with the wheels of course - therefore more risk, more premium required.
The rule in insurance is that "if it isnt written down blah blah blah" - if you declare it, you have advised them and are squeaky clean - if its not written down on paperwork you present (a proposal form or an addendum), paperwork you receive (Statement of Fact, policy docs etc), then it has not happened.

Barry is correctly saying thats its not ok for someone at a broker or Insurer to say that it will be fine = that is not good enough - if you write it down and your broker / Insurer choose to ignore it then fine but in the event of a claim they will not be able to screw you over it. Barry or Mr Insurance Man may leave and you dont have a leg to stand on. If you tell the broker and they dont pass it on, then it is their Professional Indemnity policy that will pay under an E & O situation.......

Most Insurers consider scooters to be a joke insurance wise - "you spent £1000 to make it go 10mph faster...........wow - oh well, Normal Terms thank you........"
Barry@Bikesure
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gavi4t wrote:heres a daft one ,did everybody know if you run a classic policy that you don't accrue no claims bonus? nope none at all ,so when you decide that you would like to insure something like a px125 disc that isn't classic your 5 years of riding a 69gp 200 wont count as ncb and you have to start again ,a bit of a loophole that I wasn't aware of til the other month when I went to insure a fireblade :shock:
Your insurer should actually make you aware of that term BEFORE you set up your insurance as that is a major term of your insurance.

The thinking is that classic insurance was built for people who have old bikes and don't really ride them. They then discount the prices heavily on that basis so they don't build up the no claims bonus as it is assumed you will not be riding the bike enough to warrant it.

Having said that, a good insurance company will take that factor into account when quoting for your new bike.
Barry@Bikesure
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coaster wrote:
mick1 wrote:
Changing traditional light bulbs for LED ?

Changing from split rims to tubeless ?

I know it can be a grey area but ( for insurance purposes) where does "modification" start ?
Most roders would not think it necessary to declare mods like these as they are concidered as safety improvements as are hydraulic disc brakes. Do any insurers explain what constitutes a modification that might void the insurance? Or even offer a discount for the safety ones?
Unfortunately its not for the rider to decide whether he/she thinks it is necessary to declare the mods.

Anything that has changed on the bike from the original model spec would need to be declared. So anything can void the insurance. But if you declare a modification like the disc brakes, 9 times out of 10 it's not going to affect your price anyway so I don't understand why you wouldn't want to do this.
Barry@Bikesure
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mick1 wrote:Barry has some fair points and i'm not trying to make the insurers out as "bad people" i was just wondering what constitutes a modification and what would be reasonable for the scooter owner to know. basically i bought a vespa 125 and consequently found out it was kitted. I'd insured the scooter in good faith and didn't realize i had to do an engine strip to confirm the cc or check for any modifications (other than were visual).

I totally agree it's wrong to knowingly insure a 225 as a 125 but it's more the minor modifications that confuse me. As has been said there must be very few few scooters (certainly Lambrettas) that have the same spec' as they left the factory.

Regarding upgrading the brakes, i've "heard" this may increase your insurance as you may feel you can travel at faster speeds :o

It's all a mine field and a blanket cover of saying all modifications must be notified can cause a Lambretta owner endless problems......if they notified every change.

All good points though
I would agree that it becomes a bit of a minefield when it comes to the minor modifications, especially when it's an older bike.

The main issue being that if the bike looks a little different then a thief may be more eager to steal that bike as it looks more desirable. Personally, I haven't sat down 100 convicted thieves and asked them but common sense would point you towards that conclusion. If it is just minor things then usually there is no increase though.

Personally, I have only seen probably 1 quote in the last 12 months where an insurance went up due to uprated brakes so I really don't think you have much to worry about there.
Barry@Bikesure
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Really enjoying the discussion here and I hope I'm able to shed some light on the modification questions.

The problem is that as a broker, we operate with 15 different underwriters and with over 70 different insurance schemes so there no is a yes or no answer for any 1 single thing. A lot of other brokers are the same too.

All I can say is that we are modification specialists and we cover anything from a standard classic to a completely one-off custom bike so we can cover any type of bike and usually, the cosmetic changes won't affect your prices.
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