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Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:02 am
by jonzo172
Meds wrote:Standard tactic
When presented with facts that cannot or are unable to be disputed
Deflect the debate and make it personal
Why did you turn it off Jonzo172
Employment
Professional Engineer who has to make decisions based on facts and evidence.
Present options and opinion , then back it up with said evidence and facts.
The people I work for and answer to ask awkward questions like
'What's your evidence that it's safe'/best solution "
and my favourite
"What are the risks involved with options."
To be honest I never read that paper/guidance /best practice advice / expert opinion isn't much of an answer.
Note the use of professional, which means when confronted with something I don't understand or can't get to grips with I seek out information from Experts.
I entered this with an attitude of Stay but was open minded enough that I would vote leave if a good enough case was made.
Opinion
This isn't a debate is some entrenched opinions backing ther position up with dogma.
I haven't heard one practical solution from Brexit on
How they will deal with immigration
What the return of Sovereignty will practically entail and how it will benefit Britain
How trade will be conducted
Why the EU is undemocratic, when we elect and appoint euro MP's, if you accept this as fact, the next logical step, our parliament is Undemocratic, we don't need it any more.
The whole leave argument is emotional, not fact or evidence based.
Steady tiger... factually and professionally you are in and I am emotionally out.
When I started my business 13 years ago I remortgaged my house to finance it, factually the scenario didn't really stack up, emotionally (gut instinct) it did.
The one thing I was one hundred percent confident about was my ability to see beyond and overcome any challenge that may come my way.
I feel the same way about the EU.
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:34 am
by Meds
Emotionally out is an argument.
better than the out campaign stance of trying to back it up their position with pseudo facts and half truths.
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 9:18 am
by jonzo172
Meds wrote:Emotionally out is an argument.
better than the out campaign stance of trying to back it up their position with pseudo facts and half truths.
And of course the IN campaign has been based totally on true facts... please... good grief!
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:46 am
by Meds
Jonzo
There is no point in continuing with this debate.
By your own admission, you arguments are emotional, so no amount of evidence will change your mind, it's a waste of good electrons.
So let's talk scooters.
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 1:03 pm
by Donnie
anyone got a link to an impartial site about in or out ?
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 6:39 pm
by ArmandTanzarian
The only choice is do you want to be exploited by a cabal of billionaire b@5t@rds based in Brussels or another set of billionaire b@5t@rds based in the city of London.
Neither side gives a rat's bottom about the average person. It's just a choice of how best to make the very rich even richer
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:05 pm
by 10 inch Terror
ArmandTanzarian wrote:The only choice is do you want to be exploited by a cabal of billionaire b@5t@rds based in Brussels or another set of billionaire b@5t@rds based in the city of London.
Neither side gives a rat's bottom about the average person. It's just a choice of how best to make the very rich even richer
Bingo! Probably the most truthful comment on this thread.
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:37 pm
by Donnie
So the answer to my question is no then
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:20 pm
by 10 inch Terror
Donnie wrote:So the answer to my question is no then
https://fullfact.org/europe
This site is supposed to be impartial...
Re: EU, in or out?
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 6:36 am
by a.j
Another poll on two or three sites of personal interest I use, where leave is hugely ahead.
I can only conclude that I hang about with a totally alien demographic to the remain camp. I know about four people who want to remain, and about eighty who are voting to leave.