Fair comment,especially the mazzucheli rod kit.(I think the spelling is right............)gaz_powell wrote:The SR cranks are/were decent value if you didn't have a crank. In this case there is a perfectly good crank that at cheapest could have a decent bearing put in for far less than 80 quid (a decent big end can be bought for less than 20 quid..... you could get a 107 mec or mazz rod kit fitted less than 80 quid.
Suzuki 190 set up ?
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HxPaul
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gaz_powell
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Alway easier to put maz'.....
I did roughly measure the stroke and it was about 58 mm . It had a standard 150 head on it which I guess is not right . What head should I be looking for ?
I bought this engine about 15 yrs ago and ran it with a 25 mm carb and some sort of expansion pipe that came with it . It ran ok
I bought this engine about 15 yrs ago and ran it with a 25 mm carb and some sort of expansion pipe that came with it . It ran ok
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gaz_powell
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Last time I messed about with suzuki TS185 piston it was on a malossi 172 vespa T5 and I had to get the head reprofiled - The crown profile was more domed on the suzuki.
Standard lambretta head maybe fine, but given today's petrol and less room for error worth getting someone who know about heads to advise. As a minimum the face/edge should be opened out to the size of the cylinder bore (standard 150 is 57 and the TS185 is standard 64mm)
It's defo worth a punt !!!
Good luck
Standard lambretta head maybe fine, but given today's petrol and less room for error worth getting someone who know about heads to advise. As a minimum the face/edge should be opened out to the size of the cylinder bore (standard 150 is 57 and the TS185 is standard 64mm)
It's defo worth a punt !!!
Good luck
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holty
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i agree that having the correct head is a must, the correct profile and squish will also give better power and torque, you might find your 150 head will be too high compession as the combustion chamber in the centre is quite small and shallow, i believe the genuine 175 head has the larger area, plus when you have the head reprofiled your going to lose some volume as well, i believe darrell taylor did a very good article about cr and squish in scootering a few months back, very informative.
I have a 1991 Suzuki 190 kit. I bought a scooter and the kit was fitted and the receipt for it was in the glove box! I stripped it and it all looked like it had little use, the ports had been tidied up nicely and opened up a bit and the head reprofiled. I put it all back together, set the squish etc. My cylinder has been top and tailed.
I put a 30mil PHBH carb on it and a big bore pipe and it goes fairly decent. 60mph on the GPS but with me thats like 2 up, cruise easy at 55. I jetted it similar to a Mugello 185 and I am very happy with it. If you haven't got a Mugello etc its performance is much more exciting than stock 150.
I put a 30mil PHBH carb on it and a big bore pipe and it goes fairly decent. 60mph on the GPS but with me thats like 2 up, cruise easy at 55. I jetted it similar to a Mugello 185 and I am very happy with it. If you haven't got a Mugello etc its performance is much more exciting than stock 150.
Can I get a head off the shelf from somewhere or can somebody recommend someone to do it for me ?
There are companies about who sell 185 heads already made, We just put one on a friends 190 kit and after 200 miles is functioning OK, obviously one specifically profiled for your piston would be better but its a load more hassle to get done / do.
I think we got ours from Cam Lam.
I think we got ours from Cam Lam.
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Adam_Winstone
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Most of the 185 heads are made for the cheapo Ebay type iron lined kits, which use 64 to 65mm pistons that have the same crown profile as a standard Lambretta piston (diameter to suit bore), whereas the Suzuki piston has a different crown profile and really should have a head profiled to match. As such, watch out if you look to buy a 185/190 head as it may be the correct size but wrong profile for your kit.
Also, be careful where you buy a head from as I had to send one back a while back as it was supplied specifically with a Suzuki 190 kit but I had to send the whole kit back as it was shockingly sh1t! In your shoes I would approach a dealer that has dealings with and experience of Suzuki 190 kits. Most dealers would be able to provide you with a head, rather than you have yours modified, but some would be just as happy to modify yours. Whilst there are plenty of dealers that could get this right, experience has shown there to be at least a few that could get it wrong too!
Any dealer worth their salt will also ask you what compression ratio you want it to be, whether you want any recess (to avoid gasket use), and some idea of the state of tune of your barrel as tuned kits and piston conversions can result in long port durations, which result in low corrected compression ratios... alternatively, a piston converted barrel that has little or no tuning work done may well end up with extremely high corrected compression ratio and cause piston holing or seizure. Any dealer that doesn't ask will not be addressing the fundamentals of your requirements, rather they are just making a sale... at your risk. That said, a dealer would probably be prepared to make a judgement call and sell you a head that 'might' best suit your motor.
If you wanted a kit that is a straight 'bolt-on' and ready to go, without your input, then this might not have been the best/easiest choice. However, you now have the options of:
1. Just take the risk and buy a head from a dealer, specifying that it is for a Suzuki 190 piston. Profile should be right but compression will be a guess.
2. Take a piece of paper and a pencil, take a rubbing of ports in relation to top edge of barrel, take some measurements, then post them on here (for comment from readers) and/or put them into Eden's handy port duration calculator, which will allow you to calculate port timings (state of tune of your barrel) and compression ratios (geometric and corrected) for whatever head you do get http://www.lambretta-images.com/archive/porttiming.php
3. Send your barrel (so that they can assess compression requirement) and piston off to a respected tuner/dealer and have them machine you a head to suit. From my personal experience of head work and/or Suzuki 190 kits, I would consider using MB Developments, Chiselspeed, Harry Barlow, Taffspeed, Readspeed,.... those are the first that come to mind for a decent head specifically for a Suzuki 190. Do note though that some will be considerably cheaper than others but I'd be happy trusting a head reprofile and any chamber volume work to those. NB: There are many others that could do heads well too but not that I've personally had heads done by. I can also think of 2 respected dealers that I've had heads done by that were completely unfit for use and that I returned or put straight in the bin!!!
Best of luck with it.
Adam
Also, be careful where you buy a head from as I had to send one back a while back as it was supplied specifically with a Suzuki 190 kit but I had to send the whole kit back as it was shockingly sh1t! In your shoes I would approach a dealer that has dealings with and experience of Suzuki 190 kits. Most dealers would be able to provide you with a head, rather than you have yours modified, but some would be just as happy to modify yours. Whilst there are plenty of dealers that could get this right, experience has shown there to be at least a few that could get it wrong too!
Any dealer worth their salt will also ask you what compression ratio you want it to be, whether you want any recess (to avoid gasket use), and some idea of the state of tune of your barrel as tuned kits and piston conversions can result in long port durations, which result in low corrected compression ratios... alternatively, a piston converted barrel that has little or no tuning work done may well end up with extremely high corrected compression ratio and cause piston holing or seizure. Any dealer that doesn't ask will not be addressing the fundamentals of your requirements, rather they are just making a sale... at your risk. That said, a dealer would probably be prepared to make a judgement call and sell you a head that 'might' best suit your motor.
If you wanted a kit that is a straight 'bolt-on' and ready to go, without your input, then this might not have been the best/easiest choice. However, you now have the options of:
1. Just take the risk and buy a head from a dealer, specifying that it is for a Suzuki 190 piston. Profile should be right but compression will be a guess.
2. Take a piece of paper and a pencil, take a rubbing of ports in relation to top edge of barrel, take some measurements, then post them on here (for comment from readers) and/or put them into Eden's handy port duration calculator, which will allow you to calculate port timings (state of tune of your barrel) and compression ratios (geometric and corrected) for whatever head you do get http://www.lambretta-images.com/archive/porttiming.php
3. Send your barrel (so that they can assess compression requirement) and piston off to a respected tuner/dealer and have them machine you a head to suit. From my personal experience of head work and/or Suzuki 190 kits, I would consider using MB Developments, Chiselspeed, Harry Barlow, Taffspeed, Readspeed,.... those are the first that come to mind for a decent head specifically for a Suzuki 190. Do note though that some will be considerably cheaper than others but I'd be happy trusting a head reprofile and any chamber volume work to those. NB: There are many others that could do heads well too but not that I've personally had heads done by. I can also think of 2 respected dealers that I've had heads done by that were completely unfit for use and that I returned or put straight in the bin!!!
Best of luck with it.
Adam
Thanks for all of your comments . Given me plenty to think about