Scooterotica

tony wrote:Well group 6 is a no limits race class more or less. Its about pushing the limits. I don't see why you should restrict yourself. I get the 'trying with what's available' part but not sure that's what group 6 racing is about. Now the pipe is a hybrid so already it's heading into a bespoke pipe.
Darrel has done a fantastic job sticky. Its impressive what he has done.
Not baiting him at all. Just curious why he didn't go all out to begin with by making a bespoke pipe.
But now I know he us pushing road parts I have my answer.

group 6 is whatever the builder decides it will be within the rules ,there personal choice,there budget and there ability,and time constrainsts , on top of that some(including me are first time builders dipping there toe into a big learning curve so you start out simple and as uncomplicated as possible during the trial period and progress but the ultimate end goal to the fruits of your labour is winning and when thats achieved do you keep on pushing/finding weeknesses/breaking down to then be baited about that??

group 6 is also about chassis and theres lots going on there

i have tried many pipes and the hybrid may one day become available to all

Tom Russell wrote:

Darrell Taylor wrote:ps this post was about a specific ts1245 ,well used to be ,bit off topic now

Yep, might have gone a "bit off topic" but still very interesting, you guys really know your stuff, I find these "race proven" results incredible - keep up the good work, and keep chatting about it on this forum!!

cheers Tom

Spanish Fly wrote:

Darrell Taylor wrote:welded big ear casings

Darrell.
You obviously know what your doing with regard to transfer porting at the business end, i.e. entering the cylinder bore. What is your opinion of grossly enlarging transfer feed etc. in an attempt to mimic more modern designs? Do you think it would yeild noticable gains if you were to employ similar techniques combined with what you are currently doing??
Great thread BTW!

SF

first of all i think why make the work when good power can be had without it,
nice you said entering the bore being the business end as for years people consider the base of transfers been where its at and i hardly touch them
i think bigger case feeds would give better results and when done in conjunction with a major rework of the cylinder then thats where the benefit would come from

Darrel you are doing very well. But the hybrid must be a compromise.
Go flat out is what I say !

ive tried many pipes quad/kart/bike/scooter and this works best for now ,no compromise ,have simulated many other pipe dimensions from quad/kart/bike/scooter/snowmobile as well as bespoke designs on accurate software that ive yet to find a substantial enough improvement from ,its a difficult job as hp or rpm improvement doesnt mean an overall speed improvement/lap time benefit when calculated back thru the gear ratio,s in a power range program all these tests take loads of time but much less than manufacturing ,the whole package starts with the available gear ratio,s then worked back
just because a pipe is a "production pipe" doesnt make it compromised , production pipes need designing too and could have been done by the best in the world ,who can say?

Interesting thread. Good to hear different things being tried and getting results.
The to-ing and fro-ing between Darrell the doer and Tony the talker is highly entertaining and informative

OzOAP wrote:The to-ing and fro-ing between Darrell the doer and Tony the talker is highly entertaining and informative

Tony the talker? lol

Darrell Tunes well, Tony rides well. If they both had a head-2-head and had to tune, build and ride their own machines for a BSSO series I think Tony would actually have the edge there Oz. Tony might work with Charlie to get the best out of his machine, but no one else rides it for him

Why not take your Vespa TS1 to a track day or sprint meet and see how it stands up?

Anyway, that aside......im looking forward to seeing a certain SuperMonza 250 Full bodied sprinter on the scene soon, that might set a few good times, who knows!

i have raced a bit too
in a series with up to 70 teams present and won 3 50cc championships,1 70cc championship ,a 50cc win at french 4hr and 70cc runner up at french 4hr

a supermonza 250 now that will fly if done well,the triple ex port is just what is needed to produce huge horsepower my group6 rb only has a similar ex port area to my triple port racing 50cc,s have

i have a picture in my head of Darrell sticking up his middle finger at the end of his comment ,
"scooterotica , where the personalitys of the scooter world collide"