Scooterotica

drunkmunkey6969 wrote:Lecton needles are both tapered and curved.....sadly i dont have a ready supply of them on in my tool box!

..............I see that word has reared it`s ugly head again........... "Lectron"............... much was never said about them at the time all the talkin`and knockin` was going on....... Oh!, and the testing we never really had a proper test report............they may be more expensive!.. as we all know......but as i always said they are still cheaper than a new engine!!!! ............still people will go blindly on in there own way ......but we still have to read about all those weird and wonderful, Oh! why did it happen to me seize`s.....and i wonder what it could be?.......The Lectron takes away all those dreaded misfortunes......but of course for a little more £££££`s......i do think by the time the Delly or Mukini are set up buying all those extra needles and jets the cost would probably even out......but unfortunately you do only get what you pay for the extra quality and finish of the Lectron plus the better performance.........Well i suppose all this new finding of this flat / lean spot has come about because of the new Dyno....it would be great to test the Lectron against it`s competitors and put the graph`s on the forum?...........well done Sean for all your testing work :bouncing:

do they do the lectron in a reasonable size yet then ?
ive gone for a tmx30 on my smallframe
1 cos its easier to set up for me
2 it was only £22
one thing i did find tho is when i rang my local motorcross bike place for jets for it, i was after a 250, as thats what ad is running on a similer set up i thought it a good place to start, now the bloke said 250 is very large and 200 is the biggest hes got, when i said it was for a 130cc vespa he was gobsmacked and reckoned mx bikes using 38mm carbs dont use them that big, now im suprised at that
do you think our shopping are are inefficient ?

RinB wrote:Ill put my head on block here

And say this is one of the reasons I stay with Delly
For one ive been playing with them for years and know them well and have massive spares.

But I do believe that a Delly can be dialed in better then a mikuni
Even some of the top racers say this and Im certain this is the case.

Saying this there are some charateristic benifits for both carbs

Discuss.....

Smiffy

I'm sure dellortos can be more precisely dialed in but they also wear much more quickly than mikunis. You also need to carry a huge range of jets ,needles and atomisors. I think theres a very good reason Charlie,Taffys etc recommend and use dellortos but a I still think the mikuni is a good overall carb that doesn't wear as quickly.

jonny snatchsniffer wrote:do they do the lectron in a reasonable size yet then ?
ive gone for a tmx30 on my smallframe

156 D wrote:

drunkmunkey6969 wrote:Lecton needles are both tapered and curved.....sadly i dont have a ready supply of them on in my tool box!

..............I see that word has reared it`s ugly head again........... "Lectron"............... much was never said about them at the time all the talkin`and knockin` was going on....... Oh!, and the testing we never really had a proper test report............they may be more expensive!.. as we all know......but as i always said they are still cheaper than a new engine!!!! ............still people will go blindly on in there own way ......but we still have to read about all those weird and wonderful, Oh! why did it happen to me seize`s.....and i wonder what it could be?.......The Lectron takes away all those dreaded misfortunes......but of course for a little more £££££`s......i do think by the time the Delly or Mukini are set up buying all those extra needles and jets the cost would probably even out......but unfortunately you do only get what you pay for the extra quality and finish of the Lectron plus the better performance.........Well i suppose all this new finding of this flat / lean spot has come about because of the new Dyno....it would be great to test the Lectron against it`s competitors and put the graph`s on the forum?...........well done Sean for all your testing work :bouncing:

a) The Lectron is rediculously expensive when compared to Mikuni or Dellorto
b) From a performance pespective it flows about as well as a Dellorto but a Mikuni flows better
c) A Lectron doesnt take away any dreaded misfortunes.....there are any number of reasons why an engine may seize, jetting issues are but one. Think air leaks, compression ratios, ign timing, etc etc....a Lectron is not a cure all.
d) The benefit of having a curved/tapered needle is largely outweighed by the fact that needles are 1) Not readily available and 2) Expensive to buy
e) The benefit of having a curved/tapered needle is only a real benefit over a Mikuni TMX because the Mikuni is less adjustable in the mid-range......a Dellorto is actually quite adjustable and therefore just as good, if not better.
f) You don't always get what you pay for, sometimes you can actually pay a lot of money for something that is not much better than something that is half the price.
g) Any carb is cheaper than a new engine, and will be fine as long as its set up properly
h) who is going blindly on their way? Are we all dumbos and you are the fount of all knowledge? Please show some respect to your fellow forum members.

Understand.....I'm not having a go, the Lectron does have some benefits, i'm just trying to put your post into perspective, you've made some rash statements.

If i had to put the three brands into my own personal order of preferance it would be as follows:

Performance/flow:
1) Mikuni
2) Delly & Lectron

Adjustability:
1) Dellorto
2) Lectron & Mikuni (Lectron has better mid range adj, but Mikuni has better idle and tickover adj)


Price (carb and spares combined):
1) Mikuni & Delly
2) Lectron

Ease of set up and use:
1) Mikuni
2) Lectron
3) Dellorto

So having used and dynoed all 3 carbs, i personally find the most benefits come from Mikuni & Delly. This of course is a limited test in tems of the fact that it relates only to my TS1 and there are of course other engines that may suit the Lectron better........but its a far cry from the cure to a list of 'dreaded misfortunes' that we are all dumbly ignoring for the saving of a few £'s, as you seem to suggest.

drunkmunkey6969 wrote:

156 D wrote:

drunkmunkey6969 wrote:Lecton needles are both tapered and curved.....sadly i dont have a ready supply of them on in my tool box!

..............I see that word has reared it`s ugly head again........... "Lectron"............... much was never said about them at the time all the talkin`and knockin` was going on....... Oh!, and the testing we never really had a proper test report............they may be more expensive!.. as we all know......but as i always said they are still cheaper than a new engine!!!! ............still people will go blindly on in there own way ......but we still have to read about all those weird and wonderful, Oh! why did it happen to me seize`s.....and i wonder what it could be?.......The Lectron takes away all those dreaded misfortunes......but of course for a little more £££££`s......i do think by the time the Delly or Mukini are set up buying all those extra needles and jets the cost would probably even out......but unfortunately you do only get what you pay for the extra quality and finish of the Lectron plus the better performance.........Well i suppose all this new finding of this flat / lean spot has come about because of the new Dyno....it would be great to test the Lectron against it`s competitors and put the graph`s on the forum?...........well done Sean for all your testing work :bouncing:

a) The Lectron is rediculously expensive when compared to Mikuni or Dellorto
b) From a performance pespective it flows about as well as a Dellorto but a Mikuni flows better
c) A Lectron doesnt take away any dreaded misfortunes.....there are any number of reasons why an engine may seize, jetting issues are but one. Think air leaks, compression ratios, ign timing, etc etc....a Lectron is not a cure all.
d) The benefit of having a curved/tapered needle is largely outweighed by the fact that needles are 1) Not readily available and 2) Expensive to buy
e) The benefit of having a curved/tapered needle is only a real benefit over a Mikuni TMX because the Mikuni is less adjustable in the mid-range......a Dellorto is actually quite adjustable and therefore just as good, if not better.
f) You don't always get what you pay for, sometimes you can actually pay a lot of money for something that is not much better than something that is half the price.
g) Any carb is cheaper than a new engine, and will be fine as long as its set up properly
h) who is going blindly on their way? Are we all dumbos and you are the fount of all knowledge? Please show some respect to your fellow forum members.

Understand.....I'm not having a go, the Lectron does have some benefits, i'm just trying to put your post into perspective, you've made some rash statements.

If i had to put the three brands into my own personal order of preferance it would be as follows:

Performance/flow:
1) Mikuni
2) Delly & Lectron

Adjustability:
1) Dellorto
2) Lectron & Mikuni (Lectron has better mid range adj, but Mikuni has better idle and tickover adj)


Price (carb and spares combined):
1) Mikuni & Delly
2) Lectron

Ease of set up and use:
1) Mikuni
2) Lectron
3) Dellorto

So having used and dynoed all 3 carbs, i personally find the most benefits come from Mikuni & Delly. This of course is a limited test in tems of the fact that it relates only to my TS1 and there are of course other engines that may suit the Lectron better........but its a far cry from the cure to a list of 'dreaded misfortunes' that we are all dumbly ignoring for the saving of a few £'s, as you seem to suggest.

..........If i remember correctly Dan you was the one telling me to just cool it and have a laugh and not take things so seriously on this forum, use a few smilies you said ,well now that i have you still do really have a go! :bouncing: .........So now the boot is on the other foot so to speak or really has to be!!..........well at least it provoked a good report about your experiences with Lectrons .......we were promised this some 12 months ago elsewhere but nothing became of it.....well at least later is better than never ..........I don`t think there are many more that have respect for other human beings as myself, so that comment was a little harsh but however i respect your freedom of speech as much as you should really respect mine......My post was merely written as my way of wanting that report, and i thought you being in journalism or whatever and what with being probably bored with your bad ankle would of enjoyed a better write up ....but no you turn it into a bad post ......Anyway i still think it would be a good idea to have those graphs of the different carbs and there performances to compere ......

The thing is when we are dealing with Lambrettas that how well a carb works is not the be all and end all because unfortunately size and fit come in to play.
The mikuni 35mmtmx fits better than nearly every other carb with room between it and the panel. Even better than its little 30mm brother. This is one of the reasons its so popular even though in my opinion its too big for most applications.
Racing is something else but for the road all these factors are a consideration

Diablo wrote:The thing is when we are dealing with Lambrettas that how well a carb works is not the be all and end all because unfortunately size and fit come in to play.
The mikuni 35mmtmx fits better than nearly every other carb with room between it and the panel. Even better than its little 30mm brother. This is one of the reasons its so popular even though in my opinion its too big for most applications.
Racing is something else but for the road all these factors are a consideration

You are quite right there Al, racing is something else, i have been in contact with people in the States and the Lectron is quite favoured there for the racing outfit.....also you can`t blame them for using them as they are after all an American carb. and are cheaper to buy than over here...........Of course for road use the panel is always the problem............Nice to see your about ....Gillingham is still heaving!!!!

rbgaz wrote:hi all , if i was to put a head gasket on my rb and lower the comprression would this also make it run cooler ?

Normally you Keep it cooler by lowering compression in the combustion chamber, in this way keeping the squish clearance tight.....

IN THEORY;
Increasing the squish clearance by fitting a gasket would normally lessen the cooling effect of the previously tight (close) squish band....

Squish band area and shape also effect cooling as well as power carachteristics......

I have been trying to tune my Lammy for going on two years now, with limited success. I am coming to the realization that the carburetor is the problem--a Delly PHBH28. Here's my setup:

SIL GP200 cases and ignition system
Timing at 19-degrees
Tameni crankshaft
Rapido225 with matching head
Ports and transfers matched and polished
Vertex piston
Squish at 1.4mm, no gasket
MB Developments inlet manifold and matching rubber adapter
JL1 exhaust
SX200 gearbox
16/47 primary gears

I hear mention of Dell'Orto VHSx carburetors, although I know nothing of them. They aren't widely used here in the States. Mikuni TMXs are popular here.

Any recommendations based on my setup? I want this bike to be a fast touring bike.