Scooterotica

....and that must explain the variations in starting. Some fire easily (1st/2nd kick) or like mine 3-4 kicks( or more sometimes). I also thought that the 'pulse' is generated when the two overlapping magnets switch polarity and cause the electrical current to flow in the pick up?? and so if the two parallel lines on the pick up are at the mid point of the two overlapping magnets then the timing is 'about' right??.

The one thing I have not obtained is a timing light but must now get one.

Lastly on a stage 4 Indian GP engine, the timing is 'factory set' which is what!! 19/20/21 degrees????. I suppose the only way to be certain is to strip the engine down and re-time it.
Anyone care to suggest a suitable no of degrees advance? as I have been told 17, 19, 21, or even 23 degrees?

I'm CONFUSED.COM

firekdp wrote:The pick up/flywheel marks should only be used as a basic setting to enable the engine to run...

which is what I was trying to say, but in far too many words

byron wrote:

firekdp wrote:The pick up/flywheel marks should only be used as a basic setting to enable the engine to run...

which is what I was trying to say, but in far too many words

Zactly. If you make you're own marks on the flange , using a dial guage, then check them with the strobe, the marks on the flywheel don't matter. You don't have to use the provided arrow either, just make a mark if needed. You could even mark everything on the bottom of the flange if you wanted.

I only use the 2 marks on Flywheel as a guide, as I too have noticed they can be way out from the true siting of the magnet fingers.

Always best to strobe with a marked TDC and timing needed

Also I have found that pick ups dont line up horizontally with magnet fingers hence the need to remove laminates under the pickup etc.

Talked to one dealer who buys lots of stuff in India.

He's seen those pick-up marks being put on by hand by a guy using a chisel.

Says all you need to know about accuracy really - I don't suppose Ducati do it like that. They'd have an expensive 2-armed robot to operate the hammer and chisel...

It amazes me that people would even consider using factory stamped timing marks unless they have checked them with a dial-gauge.

Does that make me wierd?

Knowledge wrote: Does that make me wierd?

No.

Knowledge wrote:It amazes me that people would even consider using factory stamped timing marks unless they have checked them with a dial-gauge.

Does that make me wierd?

The problem is IMO that until some owners become 'educated' by this forum, they assume that everything that's written in the installation instructions is correct. And therefore suppliers should be persuaded to emphasize the importance of following the guide lines laid out here.

I am by no means as knowledgeable as a lot of you are, but a number of electronic kits that I have fitted for the mechanically challenged have varied in the no of degrees advance to set up, GP cranks 21-23 degrees, LI/TV/SX cranks 19-21 degrees. I suppose that this would not make too much difference to the average road going scooter.

I dont know if anyone else does a quick check on the Ignition prior to a full build of the engine.....But sometimes, I have built the top end put timing marks on.....then before I connect the chain Its possible to turn the engine over Clockwise using a battery powered drill with a suiltable socket adapter and a 17mm socket....To set the timing Bolt a CDI unit to the engine, then connect the Ignition wires to the CDI, and earth the CDI earth wire to the Enginecase, Fit a H.T. lead, connect up a strobe light, then spin the engine over using the drill.....To make it easier to get a spark without holding the HT lead...... I have wrapped some plain single strand wire around the threaded part of the sparkplug then screwed the sparkplug lightly into the oil breather ontop of the side case then fitted a surpressor cap to the plug .... This allows me to set the timing fairly accurately prior to fitting the engine.... The worst that can happen is the flywheel nut will be undone while spinning the engine....which is why you cant fit the sparkplug into the head, as the compression will make the nut undo.....

Nothing is perfect! ...even replacing a Volvo timing belt...take the belt off with the lines all lined up put on the new one no alignment any more, but it is on in the correct place........The timing marks are only there to ensure it will run after a service or rebuild....whether it runs good or bad is another matter but it will run on the standard marks......anyone who`s anyone interested in engines know`s that the ignition is the heart of the engine, so to those interested in getting the best out of there machines will find there own TDC to make a mark on the flywheel and housing ....forget the dwell....I`m a joiner and in my trade a pencil line is only a guide and not gospel...you either cut to it..on it ..or the other side of it.....so therefore the timing marks are only guides ....this 17,18,19,degrees is only talk or supposition....every engine is different....that`s why the best performing ones are blueprinted....then you are talking accurate degrees.....As you all know the best way is roadtesting, just keep increasing advance until it doesn`t like it anymore then just back off a tad....then what would the degrees be?....you wouln`t even begin to know, but you do know the bike goes like hell and likes it........