sean brady scooters wrote:i think its fair to assume that taffy pipes for Eg were made to suit their tunes,likewise for DJ pipes...etc...most other after market pipes are made to suit a whole range of set ups and are so just a compromise...some higher/lower revvy ...some more suited to race ..others to touring...
MB pipes ,suit MB tunes..
more info would be good as per tuned lengths ,but that isnt really the whole story anyways ...
I think Sean has hit the nail on the head. If you want a pipe/tune to work then get ya barrel tuned and a pipe to match, anything else is a compromise
i may have misunderstood the original question but i don't think knowledge is trying to buy an exhaust but is being a bit more theoretical.
i would not have a clue about tuned lengths which is why im keen to see if anyone has an answer for knowledge's question. he seems to be thinking outside of the "go to xyz dealer and buy everything from him" box.
adspeed for example doesn't make complete engines but his exhausts seem to be popular so the one dealer suits all isnt always an option.
I've had mismatched tuning myself, a road/race ts1 with a jl3 didn't work well at all so it would be interesting to hear knowledge's further thoughts on the subject
You dont just work on tuned length .. there are other factors. A motor with more ex port area will require a different pipe to one with standard port area to deliver at the same rpm. So where do you want the power to deliver.. how much.. for how long.. do you want over rev or just turn it off.. all this effects the whole design.
Example: When my race pipe was being tested against the new motor Charley showed me the graph and showed me where the proto was beginning to deliver its torque. He told me he was to bring the torque in a little sooner on the next proto and with a modification to the design which basically means the whole pipe is redesigned he did exactly that until he got the power delivery to how he felt I could handle it with my size.So length would have changed as different angles would have been used.
However for standard kits...why dont pipe makers list tuned length.. they could state 'Pipe 1 Standard Ts1' designed for 8000 rpm. Torque start at 5000 and ends at 7000' etc
Some of you have good contacts out there. Ask you pipe dealers what the pipes were designed for.
Sponsors: Performance Tuning. Ve Uk. Scooter Center Koln. LTH . DRT
I think its a bit cheeky to ask adspeed for the recipe to his secret sauce.
These things take time and money to develop.
As previously mentioned I think its a lot more complicated than just tuned length, pop open a engine/pipe simulator and try looking at diameters, cone lengths, pressures, velocities, temperatures etc.
However, I've been reading a bit about exhaust recently and by specifying the rpm range AdSpeed is in fact telling you the tuned length!
Tuned length = Exhaust duration x 42545
-----------------------------
rpm exhaust is tuned to work best at
(Tuned Length is measured from piston to reflection point on reverse cone. See A. G. Bell)
So if we assume exhaust duration of a standard ts1 is approx 187deg
ADS1 (theoretical)
884mm = (187 x 42545) / 9000
ADS2 (theoretical)
994mm = (187 x 42545) / 8000
ADS3 (theoretical)
1136mm = (187 x 42545) / 7000
Now measuring my own ADS1 (which is excellent) with a bit of string (ha) confirms it's in there or somewhere about's.
why would adds be guarded about info regarding his pipe, (genuine question) any one can copy it and in fact the clock is probably ticking before someone brings out something similar. jl6 ?
they are easy to make......tin snips, rivets and silicone sealant
sean brady scooters wrote:i think its fair to assume that taffy pipes for Eg were made to suit their tunes,likewise for DJ pipes...etc...most other after market pipes are made to suit a whole range of set ups and are so just a compromise...some higher/lower revvy ...some more suited to race ..others to touring...
MB pipes ,suit MB tunes..
more info would be good as per tuned lengths ,but that isnt really the whole story anyways ...
I think Sean has hit the nail on the head. If you want a pipe/tune to work then get ya barrel tuned and a pipe to match, anything else is a compromise
Yeah, I agree with that, but coversely when you want some cylinder tuning, how many take your cylinder and carry out a road race super duper quick tune without asking what pipe you're using? It all has to work together and some pipes are more suitable than others it would seem
cezeta wrote:i think you will get a very comprehensive answer from simon at b race too
If you have a spare 6 hours to chat ha ha, boy he can talk for England.
he is a nice fella, we stayed down there for the weekend so i got the full explanation.......most of it over my head though. great part of the world and worth a visit.
Post edited by Adspeed cos he wanted to add some of his recent findings to genuine questions. But read through the thread, lost the plot and went to bed.
