ethanol, detonation, egt's?

[B-Race Tuning]

Following on from Simon fitting his egt I thought I'd just add a footnote that's scooter rather than just Lambretta related, and throw it out there for those of you that have had ethanol related damage (allegedly, of course), and those that know more. (Sticky?). If this has been addressed, please point me in the right direction
So egt is fitted, I know my timing and jetting is correct/ reliable. I take the scoot for a damn good ragging AND a plod round town AND a part throttle cruise along a flowing A road. This should give me my reference temperature to react to.
And riding along, any throttle/ load/ weather and the temp rises. Investigate immediately, methinks. Causes? My first thought, air leak? Fuel starvation? Variable ignitions? where is default if module/ cdi fails? Fuel? Exhaust cracked (you should hear that though). More please. include rare ramdoms (brakes start binding, tent comes lose, inflates and you don't notice [although if this happens, perhaps think about giving up riding... please])
And what about the gauge reading cooler than normal? All safe? just running rich/ climbed a high altitude/ mountain? air filter blocked? How about detonation? or ethanol induced detonation? And would you have time to catch it if its detonation? 8.5k, outside lane motorway, having just filled up?
I'd like your further thoughts on this, because E5 is going to replaced in the majority of fuel stations with E10 now in 2016, but no notices at fuel pumps telling you what you're putting in your tank, although I've read one article that says it would just read e10 to cover all eventualities, so russian roulette unlike say France. What lengths are dealers/ home tuners/ club engine builders intending to do to overcome this. I KNOW, that E5 WILL be available, but generally not in every one of the fuel stops you'll use from A to B on a rally weekend. And I don't know about you but even carrying a can, there are times when you HAVE to fill up NOW.
I currently have way too much time on my hands, and sleep not coming easy. I have abandoned most plans of riding this year so was looking forward to what I have to attempt to achieve ready for next year on/in my engine let alone some sort of work done/ exhausts/ income. (yeah, I know its February still ).
And no, it isn't too early to be thinking about this. And without being doom and gloom, it will affect us all. As I say, it may have all been answered, Ive nothing to be concerned about and Ive missed it and I can build my Super Monza/ RB/ TS /GT exactly as Ive built them/ the designers tell me I should (thinking Charlie's Super Monza). (Come on Richard. Retro fit, programmable fuel injection please, It'll make you a few pennies as we'll all need it?)
Regards, Simon.

[coaster]

In my experience, an egt on it's own will make you worry too much as the reading go up and down all the time due to the factors mentioned above. Used with a CHT most of the wild variations can be considered normal and ignored. Taking it easy and watching the gauges for a few miles after filling up is a good idea too

[mick1]

My EGT was going down when I holed my piston. the thought being it was showing the heat being retained in the cylinder head ? As a stand alone gauge they don't really help, coupled with a second gauge on the cylinder they can work well.

saying that I bought an Avanti kit and heat is not an issue anymore............for now

[B-Race Tuning]

If detonation is happening then the egt will have a lower temperature. The fuel is igniting way before the ignition point which causes the heat that normally goes out the exhaust port (and gives you the egt) to soak the head/ cylinder but mainly the piston creating holes (mainly) or seizure. And if you've a CHT gauge, by the time the heat soaks the head to give you a reading, the piston has already done 30/ 60 seconds. at 7-9000 rpm? Too late! With our old engines, we don't have knock sensors, multipoint fuel injection, ecu controlled ignitions/ air flow meters etc etc that allows our engines to cope with the changes happening to our fuels. And No cylinder kit, set up to run reasonably well normally can cope with a tank of high percentage ethanol content ( >5%), Regardless of it's cylinder head cooling externally- the piston/ piston crown will always cop it.
Uncorrected CR of 6:1 anyone? And hows your B/E going to like that? 2mm squish? AFR around 10/11 perhaps? etc. etc.
(As I type, I'm sure I can hear Adam?)
I don't know an 'nth of the solutions to what will be thrown at us, but I can't help thinking its something that should be being looked into a little more rapidly than actually is.
Simon

[tea5ive]

good reading , what %of ethanol is going to fuel now and what is it increasing to ? .

[ArmandTanzarian]

good reading , what %of ethanol is going to fuel now and what is it increasing to ? .

5% now going up to 10% I think. Apart from detonation, it also dissolves certain plastics which may or may not include things like oil seals and carb float needle tips.

When I'm abroad I tend to use super unleaded in the naive hope that it's less likely to cause problems.

The tragedy is that ethanol is made from plants and far from being an environmental plus, leads to deforestation and the replacement of food crops with fuel crops.
http://news.mongabay.com/2007/0516-ethanol_amazon.html http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/06/0 ... Y020130604

[B-Race Tuning]

Pot luck but shouldn't exceed 5% currently, but I would beg to differ on some supplies but difficult to prove. As much as I can find out, this "generally" is going to be increased to 10% next year. It's not flat across the board though, it depends on retail sales volume by retailer/ site. a small percentage of retail outlet will be 5%. But not at all outlets.
I can only pass on studies/ recall of reading but it (100% Ethanol) dissolves Aluminium too. now, how thick are my casings / Carb v time immersed in petrol/ 5% ethanol mix. A bit too far perhaps, but relevant even to todays motors.
Simon.

[dapper]

Just add a capful of ethanol stabiliser to your oil supply.

[dave411]

Just use super unleaded.Depending where you are,it mostly contains no ethanol.

[Speed Demon]

My EGT was going down when I holed my piston. the thought being it was showing the heat being retained in the cylinder head ? As a stand alone gauge they don't really help, coupled with a second gauge on the cylinder they can work well.

saying that I bought an Avanti kit and heat is not an issue anymore............for now

According to Charlie it will do that - heat that was previously heating the exhaust is now acting on your top end and melting the piston so temps do fall immediately before disaster.