EU, in or out?

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Meds
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Sun Jun 19, 2016 4:52 pm

Why
Are we talking about personalities instead of facts?
Are we relying on opinion, over facts and evidence?
Are we guessing instead of using facts, experience and evidence to extrapolate what the likely outcomes are?
I'm sorry if this is too serious, but it's how I keep a roof over my head, feed the wife and kids and plan for my retirement.

Herman
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Sun Jun 19, 2016 5:58 pm

The point I was making is that the vast majority of informed opinion (be it politicians, financiers, business people) are of the opinion that remaining is better for the country. The opinion of former pop stars and minor tv celebrities is irrelevant.
The list of idiots that I stated show the calibre of little Englanders - and assorted other fruitcakes - that the leave side can call on to spout their irrational, demonising bile.
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Sun Jun 19, 2016 6:36 pm

And what exactly have Le Pen or Trump got to do with the Brexit campaign? All this anyone voting out is a bigoted little Englander is getting a bit tedious now.

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Sun Jun 19, 2016 7:05 pm

Herman wrote:The point I was making is that the vast majority of informed opinion (be it politicians, financiers, business people) are of the opinion that remaining is better for the country. The opinion of former pop stars and minor tv celebrities is irrelevant.
The list of idiots that I stated show the calibre of little Englanders - and assorted other fruitcakes - that the leave side can call on to spout their irrational, demonising bile.
Think you're looking through rose tinted glasses, the Remain side can muster a few of the own idiots as Geldof proved the other day.

I noted the IMF contradicted the Bank of Englands forecast on the economy if we leave. They agree there will be a short term down turn but not as harsh as predicted. The IMF say GB could be back on track by 2020.

Both sides can get experts and spin figures to show the outcome they want. It's a question of who and what you believe and research some of the facts yourself.

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Sun Jun 19, 2016 8:17 pm

10 inch Terror wrote:And what exactly have Le Pen or Trump got to do with the Brexit campaign? All this anyone voting out is a bigoted little Englander is getting a bit tedious now.
I didn't mention bigoted. I did mention Trump and Le Pen as, as far as I can see, they are the only politicians outside the UK who are in support of Brexit.
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Sun Jun 19, 2016 8:24 pm

Well, of course big businesses, financiers, etc, are in favour of staying. They are hand in glove with the government. They look after one another and always have done.

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Sun Jun 19, 2016 8:33 pm

Herman wrote:
10 inch Terror wrote:And what exactly have Le Pen or Trump got to do with the Brexit campaign? All this anyone voting out is a bigoted little Englander is getting a bit tedious now.
I didn't mention bigoted. I did mention Trump and Le Pen as, as far as I can see, they are the only politicians outside the UK who are in support of Brexit.
So, Le Pen, Trump and the BNP get mentioned, but you weren't implying there's a bigotry connection? To even things out slightly, why would any leader inside the EU back Brexit? We are their cash cow, of course they won't back it. Without us it's finished.

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Sun Jun 19, 2016 8:58 pm

10 inch Terror wrote:Without us it's finished.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Sun Jun 19, 2016 10:03 pm

10 inch Terror wrote:We are their cash cow
Never let the facts get in the way of your argument.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe ... .stm#start
"Our dilemma is that we hate change and love it at the same time; what we really want is for things to remain the same but get better."

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Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:15 am

We don't want to be remembering that the longest sustained period of economic stability this country has known since the start of the First World War happened while we have been members of the EU do we?

The crash of 2007 was triggered by the collapse of Lehman Bros, causing a chain reaction across the US and into other highly de regulated econcomies like the UK - had it not been for the strength of the EU, and its determination to help, this country would have been bankrupt again.
It's a hard and cruel world out there. Our economic friends are across the water - in Europe, where they have a vested interest in us being successful. Going the other way, the US always saw us as the competitor to beat - the real reason for taking trillions of £££'s for armaments in WW1 until we were bankrupt and reliant on them. Ditto WW2, but having no money, that time we had to pay with our technology. No, the US is not our friend, willing enough to trade on their terms, but friend? Special Relationships? Not so much.

The big money which wants to be able to play fast and loose with shady deals in the Caymans, Isle of Man or Jersey wants out because the EU wants the money market controls of the EU banished, so they can continue to pursue their selfish agendas.
Big business wants in because they need economic and financing stability and access to the vast European market. How long will the rump of manufacturing remain in UK if they have to deal with tariffs from Europe? It was to get under the tariff barrier that Far Eastern manufacturers came here in the first place. Maybe goodbye Honda, Nissan and Toyota - taking the 10,000's of jobs with them to more secure and stable ecomomies elsewhere.

For all its many faults, leaving the EU will be the biggest disaster in this countries history since not joining when invited in the early 1950's.

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